Interview with John Lavenburg of Crux on the Protests at Columbia University, April 22, 2024

Landry: Concern and sadness over what’s happening. At a time in which students should be preparing for exams, writing final papers, getting excited for commencement, and enjoying Spring, the campus is essentially under lockdown, Jewish students feel endangered and unwelcome, student protesters are getting arrested, classes are being cancelled or forced to move online, division, hostility and class warfare are being fomented, and various outside elements are trying to use Columbia as a backdrop to push their own political agendas. The students who have come here for an education are being forgotten, it seems, by those in positions of leadership on all sides, as the toxic animosities of Middle Eastern conflicts have overflowed onto campus. The principles, prudence and courage necessary to help resolve the conflict have been wanting.

Crux: Have you witnessed the protests first hand? What is the situation like on the ground? 

Landry: The protests have been taking place somewhat regularly since October 12. I have witnessed many of them. Sometimes they have been peaceful. Many times they have been been ugly, as some in the crowds chant and behave in ways inimical to peace on campus, in the Middle East, or anywhere. It’s hard to fathom bright college students so brainwashed by ideology as to engage in slogans in favor of Hamas, to justify their actions on October 7 and, lately, to lionize Al-Qassam Brigades. The protests on campus, however, are somewhat tame compared to those by non-Columbia provocateurs on the streets around campus, in which self-identifying Communists shout in favor of Hamas’ actions as part of the revolution of so-called oppressed against their so-called oppressors. The more protestors push the envelope without consequences, it seems, the more strident they become.

The encampment itself, when I’ve passed it, has been tranquil and a more silent form of protest. Not everyone in it is there for the same reasons. Some are present not because they have a strong position on what’s happening in the Middle East but because they don’t think their fellow students in the first encampment should have been arrested.

Crux: How concerned are you that what we’ve seen will continue to escalate? 

Landry: The protests and the encampment show no signs of petering out on their own and every day that nothing happens in consequence, some among the protestors get bolder. After the first student arrests, more student squatters arrived, and, since, the encampment has just been getting thicker. Under the present dynamics, it seems bound to grow.

Crux: What would you like to see from university leadership in response? 

Landry: I can’t see any way that the university leadership is going to be able to find a mediated solution that will satisfy desires of every constituency. It’s been gradually moving in the direction of protecting Jewish students on campus from anti-Semitic actions and climate, while at the same time still trying to allow student protests, even as those protests have often involved agitators that are making that climate worse. Such compromises have satisfied none of the parties. One Rabbi has encouraged Jewish students to leave campus, Robert Kraft, one of the biggest Jewish benefactors in Columbia history, has publicly said he’s lost confidence in the university, and students and faculty supportive of the Palestinian cause have rebelled against the perceived lack of neutrality. The solution is going to require prioritizing among values and being more clear and decisive. I think that the educational mission of the university and the safety and protection of its students have to be vigorously defended, rather than, de facto, allowing protests to control the university’s agenda and milieu.

Crux: What is the path forward? How can the university protect its Jewish students, while also allowing peaceful protests?

Landry: If the protests happening on and around Columbia’s campus were peaceful, I don’t think Jewish students would feel endangered. Protests that feature pro-Hamas slogans or justifications for Hamas’ October 7 attacks, that chant “From the River to the Sea” that Jewish students interpret as a call for the elimination of the State of Israel, and that praise the Al-Qassam brigades are not peaceful, but downright hostile. The path forward must first ensure that such malevolent protests, brimming with anti-Semitism, be stopped.

Crux: Is there a role for yourself, or leaders of other faiths in or outside of the university, in solving this issue? If so, what?

Landry: I’m working very hard with Catholic students to help them recognize that the two most important things we do in any circumstance are to pray and to love. We are disciples of the Prince of Peace called to be not peace-wishers, but peacemakers, offering to others a sign of the peace he himself gives and leaves. We’re praying each day for the situation and trying to reach out to those immediately affected — Jewish students, Palestinian students and those from Gaza and others — to make sure they know we have their back. It’s normal in the face of injustice for students to want to do something, and it’s particularly tempting for gifted Columbia students to think that campus protests will resolve a 76 year-old seemingly intractable political dispute half way around the world. I try to help them focus on what they can definitely do to improve the situation here, one student at a time. I’ve likewise tried to help them learn from how Pope Francis and the Holy See have been addressing the situation, condemning what must be condemned, supporting what has to be supported, praying as if lives depend on it and showing true love and support for those who are suffering on all sides.

Crux: In general, why do you believe there has been a rise in anti-semitism across college campuses? How can this issue be addressed? 

Landry: The statistics show that there has, sadly, been a rise of anti-Semitism not only on college campuses but in societies in general. The main reason is, I believe, envy at the Jews’ being God’s chosen people and because of the many accomplishments of Jews as a result of their emphasis on study and hard work.

On campus, however, many of the protestors are not really anti-Semites. They have many Jewish friends and their opposition is not to Jews but to decisions of the State of Israel that they find unjust against the Palestinians in general and the Gazans in particular. And much of that anti-Zionism flows from the Marxist dialectic of supporting the so-called oppressed, like supposedly Hamas, against their so-called oppressors, meaning the State of Israel. The situation is not going to get better until we address that Marxist mendacity and the hatred, division and destruction that it generates.